skmonir's blog

Just curious about ACM-ICPC Amritapuri Regionals
By skmonir, history, 8 years ago, In English

SCOREBOARD
We see 69'th team solved 3 problems in 1 minute!! :O
I'm just wondered how is this possible? Were the problems very easy?
Just asking...

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +25 Vote: I do not like it

written problem statements were given approximately 30 minutes before the start of the contest(a mistake on the part of the organizers) , thus allowing teams at the site to read and write code for the problem for the first 30 minutes. By the time the contest officially started , they had already written the code for 3 problems.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -38 Vote: I do not like it

    they solved 5 in 1 hour, and none in next 4 hours ? :P

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +19 Vote: I do not like it

    I haven't heard of such management in a serious contest like Regional Contests. I also heard that some teams got problems after 30+ minutes of starting the contest. How can the organizers be such careless?

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +36 Vote: I do not like it

    Just asking, were they the only team who got problem-set before the official time?
    And, 30 minutes is HUGE..
    I can't believe this happened in one of the biggest regional sites where multiple countries take part and a single second can make a lot of difference.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -32 Vote: I do not like it

      from the scoreboard, you can conclude that many teams got problems before time(though not all would be clever to start coding multiple problems — some might as well consider as cheating).

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +2 Vote: I do not like it

    Sorry to say but written questions were not given 30 minute earlier....Infact it was given 30 min late to me...I have attended on site regional of amritapuri

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +16 Vote: I do not like it

      achha bc!!!

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +4 Vote: I do not like it

      exactly ...then u know there are parallel sites . in bangaluru it was given 30 min earlier . and how do u see a team solving 3 problems in less than 5 minutes .

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 4   Vote: I like it +43 Vote: I do not like it

Well , they had parallel sites (4 sites) ... and in one site there were given 12 problem statements about 30 minutes earlier (as far as i know) and on another site only 9 problem statements (dont know about other two).. other two statement were given 2 hours later and one statement wasnt even given . not to mention that it was an ICPC REGIONAL FINAL CONTEST .

History is made and the officials acting like its no big deal . I wonder what the Icpc committee will do about this ? I mean shouldnt they ?

and not to mention where the problem sets were given later, wes foreign team who was likely to make it on top . But alas !!!

Shame !!! Shame !!!

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 3   Vote: I like it -55 Vote: I do not like it

    Yes, the 14,29 and 167th ranked teams were expecting 1st,2nd and 3rd positions. Maybe we should host a offline contest for them.

    Your all points are valid except for the rant that your country's team did not win. The scenario was same for majority of teams. Once the contest started, problem statements were online and so it mattered little and same for all.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +9 Vote: I do not like it

      If a team can solve 3 problems in 1 minute, 5 problems in 1 hour and finishes with 69'th position, then no wonder that 14'th team could finish with top position, while they got problems after 30+ minutes.

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
        ← Rev. 7   Vote: I like it -28 Vote: I do not like it

        "got problems after 30+ minutes" — You quote statements as facts like a boss. The arguments gets over with this statement but let me elaborate.

        Got problems after 30+ minutes still those 3 foreign teams solved one problem each at 5,7 and 3 minute mark — look at the scoreboard for proof! What a coincidence. Maybe they guessed the question and solved it :P haha.

        Need more? All teams at their site got problems at same time — even those who finished ahead of them — still they got 14th — sorry they should be world finals rank 1 :P.

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it +14 Vote: I do not like it

          2 problems were given after 2 hours and 1 was not even given. What kind of contest it is?

          And u r acting like this is not a big deal.

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            8 years ago, # ^ |
              Vote: I like it -31 Vote: I do not like it

            Tell your concerns to the organizers and tell them to change scoreboard.

            As I wrote above, obviously there were huge problems with the contest and it should be unrated. The situation was similar for all, and so acting like your teams should have finished 1,2,3 is ridiculous.

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              8 years ago, # ^ |
                Vote: I like it +54 Vote: I do not like it

              By reading the above comments I don't get a feeling that all foreign teams were expecting a position within 3. The point is that the team which stood 14th is the leading team from amritapuri site. They could have been on the top 4. You are criticizing the foreign teams like they know nothing and you and your teams are godlike. The contest had many issues because it was arranged by people like you who are too smart.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -14 Vote: I do not like it

      rameshaggarwal3844 If the contest is fair then why our expectation for the 14th, 29th and 167th team to finish the contest in 1st, 2nd and 3rd position is unfair????

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it -27 Vote: I do not like it

        Maybe you did not read — "i agree with most of your points". I agree that there were huge problems with the contest.

        As a side note, come on, get over it. We know that Bangladesh is an expected world champion in everything (including cricket ;) )

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it -6 Vote: I do not like it

          You are acting like India have won all the world finals. Just go and see the scoreboard of ACM-ICPC World Finals 2015 haven't Bangladesh ranked before India.And what is your problem why are you mentioning this "World champion" word. Have India ever been a world champion? And you should notice that skmonir only metioned about the 14th team that could have finished at the top.

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            8 years ago, # ^ |
            ← Rev. 4   Vote: I like it -32 Vote: I do not like it

            I see "champion" comments being made first that triggered me LOL — link

            I agree with you and I totally believe that that top-3 belonged to you guys — still you angry at me. Bangladesh comes before India in every world finals(atleast alphabetically :) ). Sorry if I made you angry, now I will not make any more comments. End of Discussion.

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
          ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +17 Vote: I do not like it

          there is a proverb, "don't argue with mannerless people". As you have used your so many majestic thoughts lets deduce all the facts. at amritapuri multisite site all the best indian teams participated from bengaluru site. two foreign teams participated from bengaluru site. so they are out of argument.

          Now let's calculate for foreign team ranked 14 who are ranked 1st at amritapuri site. All 13 teams above them participated from bengaluru site. For ranked 14th team, what was their situation at their site? they got their problems 30 minutes after bengaluru site. meaning with every problem they have 30 min extra time penalty.

          later on when the contest started, rush of submission and ac may confuse them as at the beginning many of the teams see ranklist to find if they miss the adhoc. it might get them confused and the idea of ranklist during contest is completely invalid here.

          during contest ranked 14th team got problem E after 2 hour. but all of the teams ranked 1-13 got it at -30 minute. but achievement to indian organizer, they have succeded to give them a printed copy of the problem E after 2 hour later. after some time a new problem also added. problem K, for which they didn't get the printed copy. they have to read it from their pc while all the teams in the multisite contest got two printed copy of the problems. you know what .... they also got the initial printer copy after 45-50 minutes later of bengaluru site.

          so you should understand the situation. generally amritapuri have 4 seat in world final. 3 and 4 ranked team solve 8 problem. and that so called 14th ranked team solved 7 problem. so if they solve one extra problem and with lower time penalty they might have a good chance. but indian organizer should learn to organize a contest. from my point of view if they can't synchronize multisite contest why are they arranging it?

          and finally you should learn some manner.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +4 Vote: I do not like it

      if a normal CF round makes a mistake we all chant to make it unrated so that our ratings dont fall.. i bet you do the same chintu... and this was a regional final .. how do you even try to reason with that ? just showing how much biased and corrupted you and your hosts, authority are ?

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +74 Vote: I do not like it

In Amritapuri Regionals, contestants got problem-set after 30 mins!!! But not full set! Other region got 12 problems and they got only 9 problems!!! After 2 hours they got another problem! And also after about to 3 hours they got another problem. Totally they got 11 problems. But in another regions, contestants got 12 problems in a body!!! What kind of anarchy management is this??!!! And also in Amritapuri, foreign teams were also there who needed to make it top positions in order to qualify themselves for ICPC World Finals... I think ICPC committee should take necessary steps in order to avoid this kind of anarchy in future... Thank you...

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -79 Vote: I do not like it

    We did this so that top-3 positions don't go to foreign teams :P. Sorry that they finished 14,29 and 167th. Maybe if the contest would have been a little more fairer for all, they would have finished 1,2,3 haha :D.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +20 Vote: I do not like it

    sorry for the inconvenience! the round will be unrated due to mismanagement! :P

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +3 Vote: I do not like it

      sorry again! the round will be rated due to cheating!

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +4 Vote: I do not like it

The authority should take action about it. The mistake is enormous and there is strong reason to believe that the mistakes was intentional.

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +24 Vote: I do not like it

All of these are happening at a site which is supposed to host the world finals in the next few years. WOW

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -16 Vote: I do not like it

    India will be champion if that happens. LOL :D

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +18 Vote: I do not like it

    Now a thought experiment for you, say India is hosting WF. tourist and Petr are going to participate unofficially like in 2013. But at last tourist and petr will be beaten as an Indian team has solved all problems within an hour :V or more upto your imagination.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

      All the team who are expected to finished top of the best indian team will be given wrong problem set. After 3 hour, they will say, oh, mismanagement sir :D

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +245 Vote: I do not like it

What the actual fuck? Some ICPC regionals are literally a joke.

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 3   Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

Why do Indian programmers have to put up with such BS ? It looks like these guys ( or their "mistakes" that even some kids organizing an event won't do) decide who goes WF so it doesn't matter anyways.

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +148 Vote: I do not like it

I was the participant of the contest from Amritapuri site ( among 4 ). I am sharing problems that we faced.

  1. Contest was supposed to be started at 9 AM but before some minutes arranger announced that contest will be start at 9:30 AM . But Bengaluru Site get the problems around 9 AM ( As far i know ).And they start to read and write a code even though they cannot submit the code. But other 3 sites get the problem at 9:30 AM but we got the hard copy of problems after around 15-20 minutes. We managed to solve 2 problems after reading pdf.

  2. Bengaluru sites got 12 problems at the beginning of contest even though last problem was not in the rank list . But we got 9 problems simultaneously and rest 2 after approximately 2 or more hours . And we still don't see the face of problem L :P

  3. When we start to solve to problems the rank list was so awesome . First unique 6 problems are solved within 20 minutes , where as we just solved one problem. At that moment every contestant may feel like frustrated at the middle of contest. We was not even getting idea for the some problems in 15 minutes , many of the teams solved that problem in 1 minutes after the contest begins. See the Scoreboard

  4. All the leading teams of India are at Bengaluru Site. And that coincidence happen also there. Please someone from Bengaluru site participant answer me that, When they got problem before 30 minutes they may try to submit within 5 minutes and they may noticed that contest is postponed , the arranger of Bengaluru may give a single call to main site and main arranger may stop the contest at Bengaluru site. They did't do that. The contestant are reading and writing code freely. Isn't it like a joke?? Is it just a coincidence ??

  5. Why the indian participant are not complaining about this?? I have a answer.One team from Mysore site complained about this but the arranger skip the topic during the problem discussion section. I asked some of participant ( indian ) who are not from Bengaluru site . They said to me that, " all the genius teams are at Bengaluru site, We don't feel good to complain about this " . What type of domination nature is this???

  6. chintu, I don't know you are participant or not. I saw your replies here, Which are very unprofessional type. How can you say that we cannot get good position. Before freeze we were at rank 14. If you remove extra 30 minutes penalty from each problems our place would be top 5 before freeze. And what about our frustration about the ranklist. We got the 8th problem after 2 hours. Cannot we finish the contest in top 5?? We know you guys are very much genius , then why cannot you guys qualify fairly???

Swistakk Sir this is the fact :)

Sorry for the long post.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +11 Vote: I do not like it

    Such incidents are not good for the prestige of contests. That too on a regional site claiming the world's largest ICPC participation.

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +23 Vote: I do not like it

Sadly, this is just how Codechef prepares for all ICPC contests.

In October, the common online round for all 4 India regionals was held and even that was a disaster and was very unfair to a lot of teams as after submission of a solution, the result came out only after 5-10 minutes. And, in the last 5 minutes, the submission page didn't even open.

Our team suffered because of this and could not qualify for Amritapuri regionals.

We did qualify for Chennai regionals and there also there were issues like problems with IDEs etc.

It is really unfair as such blunders are happening even in the regionals.

And all this happens every single year. And the most shocking part is that the codechef team literally ignores all such complaints and celebrates and calls it a success.

See this. They are calling it a success, while many people are commenting, complaining about the contest.

And just because Directi is a sponsor, they just keep doing such blunders and get away with it.

UPD : This is how they ignore everything and call their blunders a success : here :)

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +7 Vote: I do not like it

    Thanks for sharing the truths. I have known from your second link that, teams of Bangalore got time 30 minutes more. How unfair the contest was !!!

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +13 Vote: I do not like it

    Dude, amrita regionals was not even held on codechef. It was on DOM
    If it was not for codechef, the situation would be much more worse
    I agree, whatever happened was unfair and was just because of lack of prep. from organisers
    But blaming codechef is not really the right thing.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +4 Vote: I do not like it

    The online was indeed a sham. Problems took around 20 minutes to be judged and you couldn't submit anything for the last 5-10 minutes at all because the site was acting up. And it was all ignored.

    The Chennai regionals however seemed better organised to me, with no judging problems at least.

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 3   Vote: I like it -71 Vote: I do not like it

Oh Well, I don't have energy to reply to every Bangladeshi kid out there, so here goes my post:

@gobindacse22 — link learn some english, it will be better. @others — if you don't find this abusive offensive comment hilarious, then what will? Still this comment getting upvoted(cause I know atleast 5 people who downvoted this) shows the hypocrisy of everyone in this thread.

@jackal_1586 — I don't have time to find links of 18 out of other 20 latest world finals and recount count-less memories of Bangladeshis crying in every field. Also, regarding smartness, first reach my level/rating before talking. Even more hilarious thought experiments can be created on Bangladeshis, pm me for details :D

@_kryptonyte_ — If you find only 1 out of 10 hate posts in this thread mannerless, you have a serious problem.

@Mohtasim — Of course, my commments are biased, and what about others and yours comments?

@silentboy302 — As I said, we did this intentionally. Kill me for sarcasm.

@khatribiru — You have some valid points in your post but don't you see I only replied to others' hate posts? First, don't you find comments made by all above people 'unprofessional'? Implying that 1-3 would have been you guys in a fairer contest for ALL was not right. And, everyone was expecting better positions. And don't exaggerate your fake points — 1. there are teams at Amritapuri site which are ahead of you. 2. Your problems statements duration timings have been increased arbitrarily. Also, organizers didn't discriminate at Amritapuri site, that 'let's don't give one team problems'. Same question, to you- if contest was same for ALL(at least in Amritapuri), why can't you qualify fairly and now whine?.

Conclusion — Please downvote this post(I care very much for contribution :D). Bangladeshi kids, leave your nappies and grow up. If you want more out of me, reply to this comment. I am all ears.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +47 Vote: I do not like it

    I hope next time you face Bangladeshi kids you'll get beaten to death in the toilet.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +28 Vote: I do not like it

      I can give you my address, you can come to my toilet, change your nappy and try beating me to death if you can :D

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
        ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +6 Vote: I do not like it

        Calling a girl to your toilet? ... Bad boy :p

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +15 Vote: I do not like it

        Reply your address here. If you dare

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
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          I would prefer that expert girl than a specialist kid for a duel in the toilet. Still, PM'ed you the adddress(you are free to spread here).

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 3   Vote: I like it +1 Vote: I do not like it

    rameshaggarwal3844 ,See This post's coments , How can you just say that just BD peoples affected ?. Think guys. And one more question to you that, How can you judge a people's ability?

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -11 Vote: I do not like it

      I am not. Maybe you should re-read my post above — the contest was unfair and should be unrated(I quoted this above too). But only BD people acting like ONLY they are affected, and the organizers discriminated among them(aka foreign teams) and indian ones.

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +8 Vote: I do not like it

        You want to know the full history of how Indian regional organizers discriminated the foreign teams? You made rules so that foreign teams can't participate in the Indian regionals. Even if they participate slots will be counted from home country's site? Now read the rules for Asia site in cj hwangs blog.

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it -29 Vote: I do not like it

          Haha, I am CJ Hwang(hence an indian) — i created discriminatory rules against foreign teams — pls sue me in your courts :)

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

    Just asking are you from CodeChef? And for note talking to you is a waste of everyone's time. And I may not have the rating or level you have but i'm confident that my ethics and principles are better than you. And you may give me more resources for thought experiments but you can learn some serious history lessons if you PM me. And are you a contestant or the organizers(if the answer to my first question in this comment is a no).

    And if you find it contradictory like I said talking to you is a waste of time and then about PMing you, I personally hope you don't. But you are welcome. Just curious about the answer to the questions.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -16 Vote: I do not like it

      Talking is a waste of time for you and still you are continuing(I am expecting more comments from you). You commented above that you have better brains and coding skills than me above and now u contradict yourself! What an irony.

      Who called history again? Maybe you don't have access to Quora in your country? Now, a tip for you — you are welcome to keep the discussion going on.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +1 Vote: I do not like it

    "nd don't exaggerate your fake points — 1. there are teams at Amritapuri site which are ahead of you"

    You are aware that the Bangladeshi team at Amritapuri was first in their site, right?

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +12 Vote: I do not like it

chintu I skip everything all other said till now. Just tell me one point why don't you guys will not be able to take such a serious contest in fair way. As far as I know management can do everything . After getting problem set in Bengaluru site you guys should distribute the problem set in other Sites also.

Let's suppose there was a problem in starting contest in the other 3 sites except Bengaluru. Then why you guys make combined Ranklist. You should make a different Ranklist for all site then merge it against the Penalty.

Our team does not get the Rank / WF ticket is none of our business . We just would like to know an ICPC Contest is the most prestigious all over the world. isn't it ?

Then why there is such a Messy Thing? And just tell me what will you do if you were a victim of such an incident ?

And how do you feel if you did not have a problem in hand while some other team already solved it ?

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -24 Vote: I do not like it

    Dude, I don't want to reiterate my points again. Please spare me. I am neither CJ Hwang nor Codechef. If I were in your situation, I would have contacted higher authorities, rather than ranting on Codeforces that I would have come 1st had the contest been fairer(cause others can counter-rant). Sue whoever you think is responsible! I hope BD courts bring the guilty to noose soon.

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +26 Vote: I do not like it

Wait wait wait... so you guys INTENTIONALLY gave a disadvantage to some participants (correct me if I am wrong)? It doesn't even matter if they were foreign .. I'm Indian and I still find that INCREDIBLY distasteful.

On a side note, why were Bangladeshi teams even competing in Amritapuri (India) Regionals? I thought each country was supposed to have its own ACM-ICPC regionals?

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +8 Vote: I do not like it

    "Each team is expected to compete only within its defined region. However, a team with a valid reason (e.g., driving distance) may request to compete in a different region for a given year. The team coach must submit such a request to the Director of Regional Contests (DRC), who will approve the request only if the decision is unanimous among all affected Directors."

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +6 Vote: I do not like it

    Competitive Asian teams should compete two sites to maximize their chance to advance, since the rule says: Each University or college in Asia can organize teams to participate in the Regional contests at any Asia site. However, a contestant can participate in, at most, two (2) Asian contest sites during a contest year.

    ref: http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_b946da100102wyh6.html

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8 years ago, # |
← Rev. 4   Vote: I like it +27 Vote: I do not like it

Where is the final scorebroad of "The 2016 ACM-ICPC Asia Amritapuri Multisite Regional Contest" ?

chintu Would you please tell me , are you an organizer or participant of this site ?

Big issues:

  1. What happened if all teams got Full ProblemSet at the same time ?

2.What happened if contest length remain 5 hour ?

Can anyone solve this matter ? If not then it is big mistake and you should admit it.

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8 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -53 Vote: I do not like it

hahaha nice to see dog bitting dog :) I will eat shoe if bangladesh ever place top 50 in world final. Atleast indian can code better. but no fear, we cant beaten from them :)

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +53 Vote: I do not like it

    Not taking any pride, but replying here only for your comment suniv_ashraf. Please see last year's WF ranklist, 2016 WF. Bangladeshi team from Jahangirnagar University secured rank 44, better than any Indian or Pakistani teams. And I was a member of that team. Sorry that I had to reply to your comment. And please see the long history of Bangladesh WF. A lot of times our coders secured ranks within 30. And this year I was also participating in Amritapuri Regional, sufferer of such kinds of situation that happened there. Thanks a lot for your great concern about our country.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

    suniv_ashraf You guys have eaten a lot of shoes already :P Still don't learn good lessons. I strongly recommend you to eat some more and see the previous history, specially previous WF ranklist :D

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +2 Vote: I do not like it

    Hey bro, do you have any shoe around you? Have a look at this please
    Just don't skip the result of ICPC-2010.
    And a request, it's not a war between India and Bangladesh. We are talking about the mismanagement of that particular site(Amritapuri).
    We all care about ACM-ICPC, that's it.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
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    I will eat shoe if bangladesh ever place top 50 in world final

    Literally nobody cares.

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8 years ago, # |
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Guys why we are creating resistance between India and Bangladesh, we all know that it was the mistake, in fact, a very big mistake of the organising team. It is unfair to all, not just for any one community. I hope we will understand the sentiments of each other rather involving in fighting like cats.

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8 years ago, # |
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Pay attention as a BD community to ICPC community so that they will arrange or argue to open a new region as well as Dhaka region, because we have many participants for contributing about this program. If it comes true then we will show how the manner, honor and reliability. Not only indian but also pakistani teams also will have invited for the day to see the arrangement.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
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    You're wrong. Dhaka site exists from 1997/98.

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8 years ago, # |
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WTF!!

these teams didn't even try to solve any problem :|

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8 years ago, # |
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Well! The final decision taken by ICPC committee is to award WF slot to individual site winners. This means that our team, despite solving 8 problems in 245 minutes from 9:30 AM (delayed start) is not going for World Finals and losing slot to teams who could do 7 problems in 330 minutes. Because we got the problem set '30 minutes before the contest'.

Here is my version of Bangalore experience (team [matrix]):

The contest was supposed to start at 9, but was delayed to 9:30. Then at about 9:10 (not at 9:00), we were hurriedly distributed the problem set. Our reaction was "probably the problem set would have been distributed at some site at 9:00 itself, so we are already catching up to them". We did the easiest problem, but were surprised to see so many different problems being solved! We came under pressure and our next AC came 31 minutes after contest start. We had 5 penalties in first hour of contest as we were trying to catch up. Then we managed to solve 8 problems by 245 minutes into contest. We finished 6th, and did not bother to 'complain' anywhere, as the RCD said that since other site teams managed only 7, teams solving 8 or more problems need not worry about any post-contest adjustments to normalize the rank list. Final rank list: http://icpc.amrita.ac.in/2015/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/ranklist.pdf

My opinion on what should have been done:

  1. Amritapuri site did not get problem G which was solved at 89 minutes in Bangalore. This is wrong as they were not having a problem that was already solved. And they got printed set late as well. So, granting a slot to Amritapuri sub-site is quite justified. But I am still not clear that how is it possible that we could submit problem G while they could not even read that problem statement on portal. The other problem that was given later to them was problem E. But it was removed from the rank list at 9:30 AM itself, after the announcement that E and L are not to be done. Of course, we did not invest any time on this problem till it was added back to rank list, which probably would have happened once the problem was distributed at Amritapuri sub-site.

  2. But for Mysore and Coimbatore, apparently they had the complete problem-set at 9:30 AM. The only advantage we had over them was that apparently we got the problem set 30 minutes earlier. So why not start our clock at 9:00 AM. That would still be unfair to us, but we don't mind that. We did 8 problems and they did 7. And if you see the rank list, the team ranked 12 got 7th AC at 196 minutes, while we got our 7th at 189 minutes. Then we got our 8th at 245 minutes. The contest got extended till 330 minutes but they still remained at 7. Why are they going to WF instead of us?

Is it that difficult to combine the rank list for sub-sites other than Amritapuri sub-site?

The winners from Amritapuri sub-site winners pushed for 'justice' because they knew that if they don't push for it, they will miss out on WF. But we did not push for anything as we were assured by the RCD Report http://icpc.amrita.ac.in/2015/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/RCD_Report_2016.pdf that top teams need not worry.

Conclusion: I would like to be guided by the community about how can I bring the anomaly to the notice of the ICPC Committee. As declared in http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_b946da100102x87h.html III (4) point note, the ICPC Committee has taken this decision.

Note: We probably will not get the slot from the rank 12 team, but at least a team who performed at least as good as us will be going through.

Of course, I am posting here to get the valuable feedback and other perspectives on the situation, before proceeding with any official thing!

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
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    Wow! Team solving 7 problems will be going to world finals and, those who solved 8 will sit in home. Slow claps

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
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    By a quick look at the scoreboard and the qualifiers list at the WF webpage, it seems that your team was the only one seriously affected. All of the other teams with 8 problems that didn't qualify had an accepted submission at time >300, which means that they actually needed the additional time. On the other hand, if you shift all the teams that had problems 20 minutes before the timer started by 20*7=140 minutes (each of the 7 problems should be delayed), then the non-Bangalore teams are pretty much the fastest to solve 7 problems.

    So your suggestion is to combine those treated fair and those treated unfair, and separate only those treated very unfair? That doesn't seem fair. I think the solution that doesn't harm anyone would be to invite all those that would advance if the sites were combined and all those that would advance if the sites were separated.

    This means that our team, despite solving 8 problems in 245 minutes from 9:30 AM (delayed start) is not going for World Finals and losing slot to teams who could do 7 problems in 330 minutes.

    Well, I bet there are teams from some sites that didn't qualify and that would win easily your site, as well as there are sites there a not-qualified team from your site would win easily. The WF is not about inviting the best 200 teams of the world (that would include 70 Russia and 70 China probably) but to invite the best from various places. Once the sites are separated, there is no point in comparing who is better.

    Was your team promised a slot in WF? If yes then you should try your luck in contacting the WF organizers and explain your situation. If not, I suppose you wouldn't advance anyway.

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      8 years ago, # ^ |
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      "The WF is not about inviting the best 200 teams in the world (that would include 70 Russia and 70 China probably) but to invite ** the best from various places **. Once the sites are separated, there is no point in comparing who is better."

      This '70 Russia and 70 China' argument has no significance here, as this is done to have geographical diversity in the contest. I hope that you are aware of UEFA Champions League...

      When sites are separated by the virtue of having distinct administration, problem set and registration formalities, then this idea is justified. As in the case of Kharagpur regionals, where the second team could only solve 4 problems compared to 8 by the first team. Of course, we do can't complain about this and think in hindsight that we made a bad decision not to participate there.

      But when sub sites get separated due to some communication glitch resulting in a delay of ~20 minutes, and share the problem set and rank list throughout the contest, then you have to merge the rank list and not treat them separately, especially when doing so results in such BIG anomalies!

      Imagine this scenario: during the WF contest, there are 8 rows of participants sitting in a hall. Someone accidentally trips some cable and all the PCs of one row turn off. Assume that they were using a text editor with auto-save feature, which ensured that no loss of code occurred. They resume the contest 15 minutes after the incident. Would you declare two winners of World Finals?

      Now, to further simplify the scenario, assume that this happened at the beginning of the contest. The teams of that row did not have any access to problem set till 15 minutes since the contest started. Remaining teams did solve a few problems in those 15 minutes. The contest gets extended for those whose start got delayed by 30 minutes to overcompensate them. And they still solve lesser problems than top 5 of the remaining teams. Are you sure that you can not compare the performance of the two groups of teams?

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        8 years ago, # ^ |
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        This '70 Russia and 70 China' argument has no significance here, as this is done to have geographical diversity in the contest. I hope that you are aware of UEFA Champions League...

        Aren't sites a geographical division? I always thought the idea of a region divided into sites was because the region is big and it's hard to travel so far away. I know what Champions League is but I don't know their choice rules.

        When sites are separated by the virtue of having distinct administration, problem set and registration formalities, then this idea is justified.

        Taking WF principles into account (that we want the best from all places), I think this is always justified. If you just think of two separate regionals, what's the matter if they used the same problemset or not? Is there anyone who gains/loses because of this? The only thing it changes is that it is immediately possible to compare these regionals, but do you really need that? CERC problems are used in OpenCup every year. I don't see any Russian guys running around and telling people that they can solve all 12 problems, while the teams that advanced solved only 10.

        Imagine this scenario: (...) Would you declare two winners of World Finals?

        No, but if a team affected by this would be on 13th place and the gap is not big, I would consider giving the 13th place medal. And if it was a lower level — like regionals, I would consider advancing a team with even bigger gap.

        Imagine a scenario: before the contest starts, someone tells you that you will get a penalty of another +20 minutes for just solving a problem and that probably you will not advance even if you do your best. Do you think your performance would be as usual or worse? Maybe you would change your priorities and at least try to get the first-to-solve prize, if you are not going to win anyway?

        As for my arguments, I have assembled a table of results if we discard problems accepted after 300 minutes and add 110 minutes to the time of all teams that got the problems earlier. The letter A means that the team has advanced to the finals. Yellow indicates the teams from non-Bangalore. I don't really know how they chose who advances, but it seems that it's only your team that has the reason to complain.

        Let me sum it up: someone screwed up. This wasn't any of the participants, and therefore no participant should be punished for that. The wise strategy is to invite more teams and be fair, than to invite fixed number of teams and harm someone. I understand that there were 4 slots. The top 4 was invited. Top teams from two other sites were invited too. That sounds like the most fair thing they could do, I only don't get why team coders_for_fun is not on the list.

        You didn't answer the most important part of my post:

        Was your team promised a slot in WF? If yes then you should try your luck in contacting the WF organizers and explain your situation. If not, I suppose you wouldn't advance anyway.

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
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          The sites are not different actually. Amritapuri is a multisite contest. Each team submits their preference for sub-sites. Sub-sites are then alloted on the basis of rank in the online contest. http://icpc.amrita.ac.in/2015/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/OnsiteSelectedTeams.pdf . Almost all the strong teams went to Bengaluru site. Also, this is the first year that this has happened. Last year the ranklist was combined.

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          8 years ago, # ^ |
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          You have not understood the concept of multi-site contest!

          "... before the contest starts, someone tells you that you will get a penalty of another +20 minutes for just solving a problem and that probably you will not advance even if you do your best ..."

          I am sure that organizers would have told them not to worry about this. They had also announced that contest will be extended. As a side note, there was an even more serious problem last year, where judge queue became too long, and the judge was changed midway in the contest. Still they could come up with an algorithm to compensate the participants! This year's trouble is cakewalk comparing to that.

          Regarding "...Was your team promised a slot in WF? If yes then you should try your luck in contacting the WF organizers and explain your situation. If not, I suppose you wouldn't advance anyway.",

          We were not promised a WF slot (even the winners were not promised anything at the contest!). But they had announced, and mentioned in the RCD report, http://icpc.amrita.ac.in/2015/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/RCD_Report_2016.pdf (point 4), that top teams ( >=8 problems) had no undue advantages over other sites.

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            8 years ago, # ^ |
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            You have not understood the concept of multi-site contest!

            It seems so. All the multi-site contests I have heard about were because the region was huge and sites were far away. I suppose all my points about diversity are not valid anymore.

            We were not promised a WF slot (even the winners were not promised anything at the contest!).

            That's a pity. If there was any announcement about your team going, you would have a good base to raise your case. One or two slots is not a big deal for the WF organizers and they may invite additional teams if there is a need, but you would need something more than just common sense for that.

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    8 years ago, # ^ |
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    I completely go with yash_15. I was a participant at the Mysuru sub-site. And I see no reason why the topper of Mysuru sub-site should be sent to the WF. I don't know what happened at Amritapuri, but I don't think there was any such glitch at Mysuru that put us to a disadvantage over teams from other sub-sites. We knew that the contest started 30 minutes earlier at Bengaluru and as long as both the sites got equal time (they did, right?) for the contest, that was only an advantage for us because we already had the "trends" on the scoreboard.

    I was shocked when I heard of this selection. Yes, the contest was not smooth and different sub-sites had different situations. And a process of normalization is required when such a thing happens. And a process of normalization often is debatable. But, what is not debatable is the fact that teams solving 8 problems at Bengaluru should be anyhow ranked higher than teams solving 7 at Mysuru.

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