haleyk100198's blog

What to do against being banned from ICPC because of HK citizenship?
By haleyk100198, history, 5 years ago, In English

Hi CodeForces,

It's been 6 weeks since my last update, asking the same question [here].

The tension here has grown even further, and now we have received hundreds of Hong Kong citizens being detained while crossing the boarder, not only academics from the HKU, but also staff from the UK Embassy (It might sounds unreal, but Google "Free Simon Cheng" for yourself to make sure it's not fake news).

I have a firm reason to believe that I am risking my own life if I travel to mainland for ICPC in the contest season (Oct~Dec). ( Again, it is not the first time that the HKU programming team is rejected by the Chinese authorities hence deined from ICPC contests. )

My chances of participating ICPC is getting slimmer as we get closer to the Chinese National Day on 1 Oct. What could I do to protect myself?

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Comments Comments (80)
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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +16 Vote: I do not like it

Sorry for you man.Be strong.I am with you

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +100 Vote: I do not like it

Give the Chinese authorities reason to believe you and your teammates are firm supporters of the regime, so they don't need to trouble you. There isn't much else you can do realistically.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

    This brings me memories of what happened to our election system recently, someone tried his best to convince the Chinese authorities that he supports the regime without breaking his values during an election (here), but realistically there is no way to persuade them into believing you.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it +12 Vote: I do not like it

      Obviously, that doesn't work when there's clear evidence to the contrary. That's the risk of being a political activist rather than a programmer.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it -10 Vote: I do not like it

        Or something that's less related to political activists, and more related to an aspiring programmer:

        [1] The police has been intentionally detaining youngsters that appear to be aged 30 below whenever there is a protest nearby (Protests are happening across all 18 districts in HK), ever since 12 June

        [2] 10 University students were detaind by the Chinese government after hiking at the Everest, 8 of which are from HKU. This just happened on the last weekend.

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          5 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it +41 Vote: I do not like it

          I think the main reason that those ten students got detained is they raised slogan in Mainland China. I guess if you can delete sensitive information in your phone and computer, and not do dangerous things during the travel, the government won't bother you. Apparently, they don't have the effort to check every HK citizens who travel to Mainland China.

          However, I highly suggest you tell somebody else where you are going to before the travel, and keep in touch with your friends all the time :)

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            5 years ago, # ^ |
              Vote: I like it +7 Vote: I do not like it

            I am a bit worried about being forced to give away my social media credentials though, which I heard it's mandatory right now. :/

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              5 years ago, # ^ |
              ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

              You can buy a dumbphone to pretend you don't have a social media account and put your smartphone in your gip. That's what one of my friends did when he traveled to North Korea lmao.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +220 Vote: I do not like it

I think ICPC is the least important thing you should be worried about. I sincerely wish good luck.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -35 Vote: I do not like it

Fortunately, you still have Hong Kong site.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +29 Vote: I do not like it

Have your univ tried talking to Dr CJ Hwang about possibilities of allowing HK teams to participate in SEA regionals? Not able to travel to China sounds like a valid reason.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
    ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +5 Vote: I do not like it

    There is a precedent for the Chinese government to abduct political prisoners from Thailand to mainland China. He did not have an exit record for Thailand, nor did he have an entry record for China, but he entered China and was detained in prison. See more in here and here.

    So go to SEA is not safe as well if he has been spotted. (But I don't think the government will do these kinds of things to a university student.)

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
      ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +33 Vote: I do not like it

      Yes, I don't believe these univ students have high enough profile that Chinese govt needs to abduct them.

      Also wouldn't it be easier to abduct them in HK?

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +29 Vote: I do not like it

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causeway_Bay_Books_disappearances

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
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        Because HK people can protest.

        Ps: There was a case of Hong Kong residents (he also has British nationality) disappearing in Hong Kong and appearing in prisons in mainland China. Afterwards, the Hong Kong people launched a parade against it.

        Pss: I am sorry to bring a lot of politically relevant comments to this community, but I think that if I don't introduce these background information, most people can't understand the situation of the blogger.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -11 Vote: I do not like it

    I did not noticed that someone suggested writing to Dr Hwang until I noticed a huge bump in my contribution (ugh, I thought I would receive notifications for updates). Sorry for the late update.

    I haven't managed to convince my coach though. Previously, I have tried to subtly raise this issue about "possibilities of participating in other regional contests" (he is behind the firewall so I had to address it subtly) after Brian Leung has fled to US, but back then he denies any possibility of us participating in SEA while advancing to the WF. The main reason being that me as a Hong Kong local who have endured the revolutions/protests on 2014 and 2016 (and a student who is possibility on his last year of ICPC career) has very different view towards the political situation compared to my coach from mainland China. From my perspective, I know that it is extremely likely that something's going to happen around the 1st Oct, but there is absolutely no way for me to give a concrete proof. Heck, nobody expected the first round of .35 gunshot being fired on last Sunday. From his perspective behind the wall, he would be damned to believe that I cannot travel into the wall.

    I have met Dr CJ Hwang previously in the HK site on last year, and I am not quite confident if he carries the same view towards the political situation to be honest.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -10 Vote: I do not like it

I don't think we should talk about politics here -- it might cause Codeforces a lot of trouble.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -121 Vote: I do not like it

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +5 Vote: I do not like it

    What does it means?It's funny?You are doing something that will cause Codeforces a lot of trouble

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -18 Vote: I do not like it

      This will not cause Codeforces a lot of trouble, just maybe will cause goverment let Codeforces cannot visible in china. but it is unrealistic.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +13 Vote: I do not like it

        I don't agree that.it will be realistic

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
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      Agreed.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
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        I agree. This might also trigger great firewall and ban Chinese coders from visiting this website.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +5 Vote: I do not like it

    Are you Chinese?

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

    zzmg, nhml

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -10 Vote: I do not like it

    Actually I think this is a dangerous action. Pasting chinese CPC leaders photos on codeforces will cause chinese authority ban codeforces in China. Please don't do that.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
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      actually they see this article will ban too.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -116 Vote: I do not like it

I am a Chinese, If you believe that protests is the way to solve the REAL PROBLEM,I can just say,Shame on you!

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +23 Vote: I do not like it

    Before you know the truth , please calm down.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
      ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it -105 Vote: I do not like it

      The truth is some youngers in HK are destroying their city!They have been used for western countries to fight with China Government!

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +15 Vote: I do not like it

        If you haven't experienced this personally, it's better not to overdo it.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +52 Vote: I do not like it

        Yes you are right! Western countries controls the HK police to shoot the protesters and throw tear gases indoors and told them to allow gangsters to hit citizen without being arrested

        Fight against western countries! Sanction the HK police "used for western countries to fight with China Government!" by spreading violence!

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +22 Vote: I do not like it

    I don't think it's related to the topic. It is meaningless to argue about political views here.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +52 Vote: I do not like it

    I'm a Chinese as well, shame on you for bringing irrelevant topics to the community.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -17 Vote: I do not like it

      I'm a Chinese too. Shame on you for making trouble for Codeforces.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +18 Vote: I do not like it

I have a lot of words to talk to you, about the politics. I'm not even sure about what to start with. But it's sure that it makes no sense to talk about these topics here.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it -19 Vote: I do not like it

    NOTHING ARE VALUEABLE TO SOME HK PEOPLE.

    not just about politics.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +8 Vote: I do not like it

I understand your worry about the ongoing affair, but it seems your best bet is to wait.

The reason is the order of events. As you said, the ICPC regional contests are between October and December. In other words, they all happen after Oct 1. Hence, if you worry that something might happen on the Chinese National Day, you can still base your decision on what actually happen on that day. You can change your travel plan afterwards, for example.

Of course, if you also have concerns about safety within Hong Kong, temporarily moving to somewhere outside China until things gets settled down is recommended.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +42 Vote: I do not like it

这就是个求助帖，完全没必要扯到政治。请你们消停一下。这对任何人都没好处。

This blog is just for help with nothing related to politics,so please stop.Arguement helps nobody.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +29 Vote: I do not like it

    Yes. I wish people from the both sides of argument stop politicizing this blog post.

    Back in 2011, ICPC World Final was originally scheduled in Egypt but then riot/revolution (depending on your PoV) happened, and then the event was rescheduled to Orlando, FL. Thus I have an Egyptian visa on my passport but I have never visited that country.

    That doesn't mean I or the ICPC committee support or oppose either version of the Egyptian government. Actually I would simply acknowledge I know too little about Egypt to place my judgement on anything happened there. I believe the ICPC stuff made their decision because of safety concern instead of political alignment too.

    Political things happen, our lives can be affected, sometimes not in ways we like, but it doesn't mean we need to treat everything as political.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +106 Vote: I do not like it

Don't forget life doesn't stop when you don't advance to ICPC WF. Find interesting job and train for GCJ

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +24 Vote: I do not like it

    True, funny enough that's what my internship boss told me too.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -20 Vote: I do not like it

I'll be sorry if you were actually banned from ICPC because of HK citizenship, but now, the only thing you can and you should do to avoid reducing your chance to ICPC is try not to discuss more on politics.

You have to believe that if Chinese authorities ban all HK citizens maliciously, it won't change because of your identity as a HKU student or what you have done for your "FREEDOM". However, in my opinion, Chinese authorities are just doing the right thing to protect the safety of all the Chinese, including HK citizens. All what the protesters have done is just to produce chaos in HK, an indivisible part of China.

Also, I have to correct your words about Simon Cheng, who was detained because of visiting PROSTITUTES, which can't be legal in China.

Finally, I have to apologize for what other Chinese students have said in Comments to you. That's shameful.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
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    You don't need apologize.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +41 Vote: I do not like it

    I am trying to avoid discussing politics publicly, but, I am a somewhat straightforward person and it's hard for me to agree with something that is against my will, especially when it comes to the fate of my homeland. Honestly, I don't know if my trigger will go off when I cross the boarder and I'd rather go through all the troubles that ensure I could compete as safe as possible.

    You need not to apologize, I do understand that people have their own opinions. To be honest, my personal political stance probably do sound as irritating as some of the comments here. I could try my best not to share them online, but if the customs forces me to share it, then oh well .... I am bad at lying.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
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      In fact, I can infer your stance from the recent article you post. I have to admit that when I was writing the comment, there were some bad emotions in me. I did feel uncomfortable about your stance, but I tried to hide it. I'm glad to see you are also that kind of person.

      Anyway, now you just need to post as few views on politics as possible to avoid others' attention. Asking for help on Codeforces may be safe, but other social media like Twitter or Facebook can lead more danger.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -75 Vote: I do not like it

stop spreading propaganda on codeforces their is clear smell of propaganda from ur post and i am not chinese btw but cheap f* like u exist in every country and i dont give two f* to anyone downvoting it

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5 years ago, # |
← Rev. 3   Vote: I like it +4 Vote: I do not like it

Be strong

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +3 Vote: I do not like it

    don't know why that people downvote on my comment. I just want the author of the blog not be so sad!

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

The situation in Hong Kong is not promising. Realistically speaking, you should focus more on finding a job in big tech companies in the US and try to get a green card.

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5 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +31 Vote: I do not like it

For those who are interested in discussing politics with me, regardless if you are pro-establishment (建制), pro-democratic (泛民), localist (本土), indepdence (港獨), or even seeking for scorch (焦土), I am happy to discuss them with you -- Many youngsters living in Hong Kong do have a keen interest in discussing them in private occassions.

The only problem is, as I am possibly travelling to the mainland soon, you know what I am going to reply, don't you?

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +24 Vote: I do not like it

    I think the best answer is,if you are not a rebel,the Chinese government will not prohibit your passage.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -91 Vote: I do not like it

钓鱼贴？支持大陆就禁言？？ 我支持中国政府，你们可以禁言我了。 I support the Chinese government, and you can ban me now.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +37 Vote: I do not like it

    It's not about supporting or not. Please don't talk about irrelevant topics here, such as, arguing about political views.

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    5 years ago, # ^ |
      Vote: I like it +5 Vote: I do not like it

    Could you stop being ridiculous? Is there any content related to what you said in this blog?

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
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      Because my friend's comment was deleted just now and he was banned for two days.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
          Vote: I like it +7 Vote: I do not like it

        It is one who banned your friend, i.e. Codeforces coordinators to blame. Instead of the blogger, or anyone who read the blog.

        STOP BEING RIDICULOUS.

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      5 years ago, # ^ |
        Vote: I like it -42 Vote: I do not like it

      Why are you so fierce?

      I always says,if you are not a rebel,the Chinese government will not prohibit your passage.

      Why is the author afraid of the Chinese government?I think it is because of his guilty conscience,but this is just my guess and does not represent any political position of mine.

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        5 years ago, # ^ |
        ← Rev. 6   Vote: I like it +18 Vote: I do not like it

        What you said cannot answer the question: "Is there any content related to what you said in this blog?"

        More specifically, the blogger said: I'm afraid that I can't go to Mainland China to participate regional, and Hyscere_ said: I support Chinese government! Do you really think it is an appropriate comment? If your answer is yes, please let me know, and we can block each other because we really have different values.

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          5 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it -26 Vote: I do not like it

          "If you are not a rebel,the Chinese government will not prohibit your passage."

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            5 years ago, # ^ |
            ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +10 Vote: I do not like it

            More specifically, the blogger said: I'm afraid that I can't go to Mainland China to participate regional, and Hyscere_ said: I support Chinese government! Do you really think it is an appropriate comment? If your answer is yes, please let me know, and we can block each other because we really have different values.

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              5 years ago, # ^ |
                Vote: I like it -31 Vote: I do not like it

              I think it isn't.But someone was banned just beacuse they said something which supports Chinese government.Do you think it's right?

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                5 years ago, # ^ |
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                Come on; the blogger doesn't have the ability to ban any user. Why complain under this blog instead of talking to MikeMirzayanov? It does not make sense at all.

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          5 years ago, # ^ |
            Vote: I like it -16 Vote: I do not like it

          His friend had been banned before.

          So where do you think the better reply location is? Because I think this thing is really related to this blog.

          Don't reply to me anymore, because I don't want to talk about it anymore.

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            5 years ago, # ^ |
            ← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

            I don't want to talk about it, either. But I can help to correct a basic fact: the blogger can't ban any user. What makes you think here is the best place to complain? Why not talk to MikeMirzayanov who can ban or unblock users.

            Take a step back, if he wants to fight for his friends, why not introduce the context? What he said is, "I support the Chinese government" instead of "My friends were maltreated." How could a person know what has happened by "I support ..."?

            I know that you are standing on the side of your friend, but respecting facts is the basis of all communication. If you insist on standing in the queue regardless of the facts, there is nothing we can talk about.

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              5 years ago, # ^ |
                Vote: I like it 0 Vote: I do not like it

              Oh,I think there may be some misunderstanding in the middle.

              "I support the Chinese government" is a 梗(maybe it can be interpreted as a joke),you may have read different information from it and lead to the current situation,I apologize for this.But I really don't want to make any remarks about this matter once again. I am really embarrassed if I bother you, but I just want to express my opinion on the author's blog, isn't it? :D

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -47 Vote: I do not like it

钓鱼贴？支持大陆就禁言？？ 我支持中国政府，你们可以禁言我了。 I support the Chinese government, and you can ban me now.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it -50 Vote: I do not like it

钓鱼贴？支持大陆就禁言？？ 我支持中国政府，你们可以禁言我了。 I support the Chinese government, and you can ban me now.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +3 Vote: I do not like it

If you show the sincerity of learning and communication, everyone will respect you.

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5 years ago, # |
← Rev. 2   Vote: I like it +3 Vote: I do not like it

I think your team go to China mainland and travel is simple thing.

But get WF ticket is not easy.

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5 years ago, # |
  Vote: I like it +25 Vote: I do not like it

Please. Those people who said " I support the Chinese government" aren't banned because of political reasons; they are banned because their comment does not provide help or advice to the blog writer (which is the main purpose of this blog), but does the exact opposite.

Can we just stop discussing politics here and focus on the help and advice?

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